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Improving Pilum?

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Re: Improving Pilum?

Post by Jim Webster on Thu Jun 18, 2015 10:26 am

If you don't want legionaries with pilum then you're really looking for Late Romans Very Happy
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Re: Improving Pilum?

Post by GamesPoet on Thu Jun 18, 2015 2:11 pm

I tend to agree with not making the Pilum optional.

Don't see the Roman generals waking up in the morning, and saying, "Ok gentlemen, we're not bringing our pilums with us today, we're just bringing shields and swords."

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Re: Improving Pilum?

Post by Gaius Cassius on Thu Jun 18, 2015 2:41 pm

I don't think GG is proposing that players get to choose whether Roman legions are armed or not armed with pilum. I think what he was saying was that players could choose to model the pilum effect either by paying for it outright and using the current rules or instead see it as modelled within the rating of the Roman legions (ie. one of the reasons they are VBU6) and taking the reduction in cost.
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Re: Improving Pilum?

Post by Tarty on Fri Jun 19, 2015 12:47 am

Gaius Cassius wrote:I don't think GG is proposing that players get to choose whether Roman legions are armed or not armed with pilum. I think what he was saying was that players could choose to model the pilum effect either by paying for it outright and using the current rules or instead see it as modelled within the rating of the Roman legions (ie. one of the reasons they are VBU6) and taking the reduction in cost.

If you don't pay for pilum then they become just another VBU 6 FP....sounding like a choice to me.

Margherita without basil isn't a Margherita anymore.
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Re: Improving Pilum?

Post by Gaius Cassius on Fri Jun 19, 2015 1:45 am

Tarty wrote:
Gaius Cassius wrote:I don't think GG is proposing that players get to choose whether Roman legions are armed or not armed with pilum. I think what he was saying was that players could choose to model the pilum effect either by paying for it outright and using the current rules or instead see it as modelled within the rating of the Roman legions (ie. one of the reasons they are VBU6) and taking the reduction in cost.

If you don't pay for pilum then they become just another VBU 6 FP....sounding like a choice to me.

Margherita without basil isn't a Margherita anymore.

Yes, I agree from a modelling point of view there is a choice. I was more responding to the comment that posters were making about generals waking up and deciding whether the troops would be armed with pilum or not. It is a question of modeling pilum, not whether historical troops our figures represent are armed with pilum.
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Re: Improving Pilum?

Post by GamesPoet on Fri Jun 19, 2015 2:29 am

I wasn't suggesting that pilums be modeled or not ... lol. That's a good one! Lol ... best laugh I've had in a good while, thank you! : )

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Re: Improving Pilum?

Post by Granicus Gaugamela on Fri Jun 19, 2015 3:17 am

I was actually positing a solution that had pilum as an option in and of itself. From my reading they weren't always used in period, sometimes they weren't effective etc.

Let the player choose and accept the consequences, personally I'd be taking them as for 3 points they're a cheap potential disruptor, but others may choose to use slightly different tactics, which I believe could be supported by historical readings.

Equally it's just a suggestion, not worth dying in a ditch for.

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Re: Improving Pilum?

Post by GamesPoet on Fri Jun 19, 2015 4:06 pm

Lol ... good to know I understood it correctly, and sounds like if there's historical evidence to back it up, my comment regarding the Roman general telling his troops not to take them seems irrelevant. My apology and thank you.

As for modeling pilum's, I actually have Romans modeled both ways ... lol. Life is such a hoot.

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Re: Improving Pilum?

Post by Jim Webster on Fri Jun 19, 2015 5:26 pm

Granicus Gaugamela wrote:

Equally it's just a suggestion, not worth dying in a ditch for.

Very few things are


After what you might consider 'mature consideration' I think it's possible for a player to feel that Legionaries are 6/2 (or whatever) precisely because they do have pilum. In which case you could feel that adding a pilum rule is a case of gilding the lily.
If an opponent explained this to me and none of his units ever had pilum, I'd be fine with that.

If on the other hand he had pilum when fighting against army x but not when fighting against army y, or had it for some units but not others (With the obvious exception of Punic wars republicans Smile  ) then I'd feel it was a bit gamey to be honest and just an attempt to minimax the army

Jim
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