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Vapnartak York Feb 2018- format options?

Wed Oct 18, 2017 8:26 am by Cyrus The Adequate

Hi everyone

I was pondering the options for the York competition and wondered …

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BI2 tournament - 25 March 2017

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Some newbie questions

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Some newbie questions

Post by frankom89 on Wed Apr 13, 2016 4:27 am

Hi first i would like to introduce.. im new, im from argentina (sory for my english). I have just started to play adv. imp. weekly with my friends (a-a-w.com.ar/), and after every play we discover we had made something wrong! jajja.
here i have some doubts i would like you to help us please (sory if they are stupid) thanks.
1)

2)

3)

4)

5)

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Re: Some newbie questions

Post by Granicus Gaugamela on Tue Apr 19, 2016 12:48 pm

Question 1: You pivot/wheel up to your maximum distance with the corner that moves. That is all you can do, you do not get to use any remaining portion of movement to go straight ahead.

Your example A is correct.

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Re: Some newbie questions

Post by Granicus Gaugamela on Tue Apr 19, 2016 12:52 pm

Question set 2

The CM, being on opportunity, can charge at any point during the active player's movement.

The active player can never evade, only the inactive/passive player can evade.

If the CM are NOT on Opportunity then they can only charge if the fire come from within their ZoC.

They can evade against any fire that comes in through any part of their frontal projection so any firing that even remotely crosses the ZoC you have drawn allows them to evade.

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Re: Some newbie questions

Post by Granicus Gaugamela on Tue Apr 19, 2016 12:56 pm

Question 3 I'm not certain what you're asking, but if shortbow B are at a range of 30U then they are out of range against any infantry target.

If the actual range is within 15U after the movement then your calculation is correct and the end number is 0 dice so they cannot fire. It is only in melee that you get a minimum of 1 dice.

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Re: Some newbie questions

Post by Granicus Gaugamela on Tue Apr 19, 2016 12:59 pm

Question 4 I'm uncertain of your question.

A charge ends when either

1) you contact the enemy

2) if you try and contact the enemy but you do not roll sufficient charge bonus distance to make contact then you move as far as the movement allowance and charge bonus allow, you stop there and you are disordered.

3) If the unit evades your potential charge then that action becomes a normal movement action and you must move at least as far forward as the initial position of the evading unit. You can then, provided you pass any required discipline test, make a subsequent move which may also be a potential charge on the same unit.


Last edited by Granicus Gaugamela on Tue Apr 19, 2016 1:35 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : Update on condition 3 as supplied by GC)

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Re: Some newbie questions

Post by Granicus Gaugamela on Tue Apr 19, 2016 1:04 pm

Question 5: Assuming you keep the wheel/pivot and the movements separate (in your diagram you need to wheel on a front corner) then the CM will wheel toward the enemy and then move directly toward him.

Given the charge is heading directly toward the target unit they CANNOT fire when the CM enter their ZoC unless they re on Opportunity (not indicated).

It appears the S have evaded in the last frame of the diagram which is certainly allowed, that would mean the CM do a Potential Charge, if the S evade far enough back to get out of the way then that Potential Charge becomes a regular move and the CM, if they pass their discipline test, can make another potential charge toward the S, who an then choose to evade again (assuming they pass their test).

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Re: Some newbie questions

Post by Gaius Cassius on Tue Apr 19, 2016 1:26 pm

I think question 4 is asking where the charge stops when the unit being charged evades. In that case, the charge move is converted to a normal move and the advancing unit must move at least as far as to occupy the ground of the evading unit and can move up to its full movement distance.
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Re: Some newbie questions

Post by Granicus Gaugamela on Tue Apr 19, 2016 1:35 pm

Gaius Cassius wrote:I think question 4 is asking where the charge stops when the unit being charged evades. In that case, the charge move is converted to a normal move and the advancing unit must move at least as far as to occupy the ground of the evading unit and can move up to its full movement distance.

Good point. Post updated.

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Re: Some newbie questions

Post by frankom89 on Tue Apr 19, 2016 3:13 pm

Excelent you answer all thanks you very much granicus! Also im happy you understand what de doubt was perfect.
I only have one doubt left.. In example 2. When you do an oportunity charge against S, can S shoot before being dispersed? ( If it could... Do it have any penalize? Which distance do you use for the final fire?) thanks again

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Re: Some newbie questions

Post by Gaius Cassius on Tue Apr 19, 2016 8:40 pm

frankom89 wrote:Excelent you answer all thanks you very much granicus! Also im happy you understand what de doubt was perfect.
I only have one doubt left.. In example 2. When you do an oportunity charge against S, can S shoot before being dispersed? ( If it could...  Do it have any penalize? Which distance do you use for the final fire?) thanks again

You ask a good question. I haven't seen this scenario very often because normally someone would not advance an S unit against an enemy CM on Opportunity to within 12 or 13U. In looking at 7.8 it seems to me that the S unit would get what is called a "death throw" if the CM opportunity charged beyond Point Blank range.
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Re: Some newbie questions

Post by frankom89 on Tue Apr 19, 2016 9:35 pm

we were playing germanic against romans and both had our cavalry in the same flank. so the germans sent an S of javalin to rush against roman CM.
As you just told its allowed to make a "death throw" then from my point of view is a good strategy if they have the chance to make at least 1 kill or do disorder throwing 5 dices before suicide jaja!! and soon after you make a charge with the germanic CM behind. i will use it!
thanks both


Last edited by frankom89 on Tue Apr 19, 2016 9:43 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Re: Some newbie questions

Post by frankom89 on Tue Apr 19, 2016 9:41 pm

6)
A player advance his FL impetuous against my FP.
By mistake, because he is a new player, he enter my ZOC. (instead of staying outside and charge in a 2d movemnt)

Can i ask an oportunity charge? (if i was not in oportunity?)
And if i were, and charge, can he ask for a counter charge? (being him the active player)

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Re: Some newbie questions

Post by Gaius Cassius on Wed Apr 20, 2016 2:58 am

frankom, don't forget that the S "death throw" uses the Short Range ratings and not the Point Blank ratings. So no 5 dice. Probably 2 or 3. And you'll find that throwing away S can add quickly to your command routing.
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Re: Some newbie questions

Post by frankom89 on Wed Apr 20, 2016 6:05 pm

sory im being annoying... but i try to find "death throw" in the rules and cant find it. So i will bother you again with this examples please.

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Re: Some newbie questions

Post by Gaius Cassius on Wed Apr 20, 2016 8:55 pm

I put "death throw" in quotations because that is what we call it. It is not an Impetus term and you will not find it in the rules. Probably a better term is dispersal shot.

Remember, the CM contacts the S and automatically disperses the S. The S is removed but may fire at short range provided the charger did not start with the Point Blank range or the Skirmishers did not move into the charging unit's ZOC and provoked the opportunity charge. It is all in 7.8.  

A. Yes, gets dispersal shot at short range.
B. S fires at Point Blank Range (shoots at the middle of the closest edge which is 4U.)
C. S fires at Point Blank range and the CM opportunity charges and disperses the S (no dispersal shot.)
D. S can either evade or be dispersed (no dispersal shot allowed because charge begins within the PB range of the S unit.)

I have lost many a game because I was cavalier with VD. Throwing away S is a good way to lose a game. There are times, however, when sacrificing an S is a good idea and that it what makes Impetus so fun.
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Re: Some newbie questions

Post by frankom89 on Thu Apr 21, 2016 4:58 am

Again thanks a lot! I believe there wont be any other doubts about how to of s. I hope i have no more questions about something else for long (you deserve some time jjaj)

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Re: Some newbie questions

Post by Cyrus The Adequate on Fri Apr 22, 2016 8:10 am

Can I go back to q1 and point out that Impetuous troops that are out of control do - and indeed must, wheel in the direction of the nearest qualifying enemy and move as per your diagram 1B. "Normal" units do not
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Re: Some newbie questions

Post by Gaius Cassius on Fri Apr 22, 2016 3:25 pm

Good reminder Cyrus. The diagram and commentary was around CM wheeling so I think GG and I took the question literally. Since there aren't any impetuous CM in Impetus neither of us worried about it.
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Re: Some newbie questions

Post by SteveI42 on Sat Apr 23, 2016 4:35 am

Cyrus The Adequate wrote:Can I go back to q1 and point out that Impetuous troops that are out of control do - and indeed must, wheel in the direction of the nearest qualifying enemy and move as per your diagram 1B. "Normal" units do not
Im a bit rusty on the rules but: I agree if they wheel in that situation that is how they do it however I thought they also had the option to advance straight forward. If so that would make the "indeed must" part of the reply incorrect. Sorry in advance if I've got that wrong

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Re: Some newbie questions

Post by Zippee on Sat Apr 23, 2016 8:27 am

This be what the rules say:

5.3 - When activated, Out of Control troops must move at least one full movement phase straight ahead.

5.3 - Apart from Scythed Chariots, Impetuous troops may perform a free wheel before their compulsory movement...but only in the direction of the closest enemy [exceptions] or in a direction chosen to avoid Difficult or Impassable ground

Amendment to Paragraph 5.3. The free wheel allowed to impetuous troops in order to point towards the closest enemy or to avoid Difficult or Impassable ground is now subtracted from the movement. This initial wheel is not an autonomous movement phase and so can be combined with a straight movement, but the total distance covered cannot exceed the maximum speed allowed for the unit in a movement phase.

So it's quite clear that any wheeling of Out of Control Impetuous troops is optional not mandatory
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Re: Some newbie questions

Post by Cyrus The Adequate on Sat Apr 23, 2016 8:44 am

Yup - my bad - I was trying to explain that they have to make the whole of their movement distance including the wheel when wheeling to face rather than the wheel itself being manditory
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Re: Some newbie questions

Post by Gaius Cassius on Sun Apr 24, 2016 2:28 am

I didn't notice the word "must" in Cyrus' answer or I too would have happily joined in his flogging. Very Happy

As it stands, I must share his shame in carelessly promoting false understandings of the rules!
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Re: Some newbie questions

Post by Zippee on Sun Apr 24, 2016 7:11 am

Apologies wasn't intending it to feel like a flogging.

Just wanted to be crystal clear - future searches for newbie questions and all that.
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Re: Some newbie questions

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